Monday, May 30, 2016

Game of Thrones: Season 6 Episode 6 - Blood of My Blood (Discussion)

Happy Memorial Day everyone!  I remember way back in time when Game of Thrones would take the weekend off to preserve the impact of important episodes such as ones that portrayed "The Red Wedding".  Here we are a few years later and the holiday weekend is "just another weekend".  In reality, of course, we all probably had plans over the weekend that are of a traditional sort.  That certainly is the case for me so I did not have time to recap the episode this week let alone probably even watch Sunday night!  

So, we will just have an informal discussion about the episode here when we all get the chance to watch the episode.   Hope you all enjoyed your weekend, hope you forgive me for not having my usual ramblings and I'll see you next week! 


Mike V. said...

Well somehow I squeezed the episode in late last night. It was phenomenal! I'm loving this season. Cold hands benjen!! Jaime and brienne are both headed to river run to potentially resume their book story!! Arya is arya again!! Even the Sam/gilly stuff was great. And of course Dany had another big dragon moment. Key word being big because drogon is huge!! And she's finally ready to head west!!

I have tons I want to discuss but it's still a holiday so my time is limited. But we'll all get there eventually!

Anonymous said...

LOL, it was only a couple of eps back that Dany was talking like she was going to conquer Esos. Now she's moving onto Westeros asap, if she can get some ships. Daario's point on conquerer vs ruler seems legit. I still don't see Dany making a full landing in Westeros this season.

Tommen betraying his mother and the others for the sake of the Sparrow seems kind of weak. I get that it sends Jaime to Riverrun, and oh yea, Tommen's not happy with Jaime either. I'm not buying Margery's new found religion.

So, Ben having to save Bran makes HOdor's death even more senseless. Great backstory on the Children saving Ben with the dragonglass. There is a lot to consider with that. For one, why didn't he turn into a night walker? I wonder what Ben will think now that the Children are gone. I read where some are hoping for a Ben/red priestess deal.

I loved Sam getting Heartbane!!!

I really liked this ep for having dragons, the storyline re the North and even Aerys and the tower. LOTs of nuggets.

It's going to be interesting to see how the clash at Riverrun goes. For one thing Jamie can't fight and he and Brienne are on opposite sides. I guess that battle will happen before Ramsey is dispatched.

Any bets on Arya killing the waif and making a comment about a sword vs a stick-lol.

If there was a near perfect ep for LS, the Riverrun battle would be it!!!!


Mike V. said...

Gonna comment more tomorrow when I have more time but I still debate al the children of the forest being killed. Here's a game of thrones wiki update (show only not books).

"During one of his visions, Bran is shown the darkest secret of the Children: they long ago created the White Walkers from captured First Men. When he awakens, he demands an explanation from Leaf, who tries to explain that they had no choice, as they were at war. Later, Bran's attempts to quicken his vision quests draw the attention of the Night King, who shortly thereafter storms the cave. The Children of the Forest present put up a fight at the cave's entrance and within the cave itself, but most of them are cut down in the ensuing battle. Leaf survives to cover Bran and Meera's escape, but makes the ultimate sacrifice by allowing the wights to envelop and cut her down while she detonates an explosive weapon making her race presumably extinct. It has been speculated that there are pockets of other Children of the Forest elsewhere around Westoros. [10]
Last sentence implies there might be more. But if you look at the page they're also referred to as extinct. But it may have always said that as they were believed to be extinct by the rest of westeros.

And yes. Freys reintroduced as well as walder and Jaime and brienne in riverrun. If LS doesn't happen I'm gonna be a little annoyed! Lol

I'll comment on rest later.

Anonymous said...

Children--well I've rewatched and looked at the background stones, trees, cave etc as well as read several who agree that the place where they died was a special place and their HQ if you will. And the show

"Leaf survives to cover Bran and Meera's escape, but makes the ultimate sacrifice by allowing the wights to envelop and cut her down while she detonates an explosive weapon making her race presumably extinct. It has been speculated that there are pockets of other Children of the Forest elsewhere around Westoros. [10]"

So, this from the link and your post even says they were presumably extinct now. There is no speculation that some may be elsewhere from the TV show by the actual actors. Maybe Bran will later say there are some? But that's like a pure hope at this point.

I think in a way their extinction also points to just how dramatic this time period is. The Wall will likely come down now thanks in some part to Bran. The dragons coming back is also pointing to a special time. And I'm still thinking something is going to come of Jorah.


Mike V. said...

Okay, I'm ready to comment on everything:

So, let's be careful not to go down the LOST route of being disappointed based on built up expectations in our heads for how things may go. I fear you may be going down that route with Dany conquering Essos. I don't think that was ever really something the show was trying to strongly convey (if even trying to convey at all). Yeah Dany going to Westeros this season would be tough given 4 episodes to go and a long journey to Meereen still. She might be rolling in just in time to meet up with some iron born. lol

Tommen is easily swayed by people who seem to be wise and giving him sage advice. Now Margaery helped sway him to the Sparrow too. I agree, I'm sure she's up to something but she didn't clue Tommen in if she is.

I don't see why Hodor's death becomes senseless because of Benjen/Coldhands appearance? There's an interview with the Bran actor who discussed how it's better for Benjen to show up now than earlier since he had plenty of people to guide him to the he's ready for another guide to take him to the next phase. I thought it was great. Hodor had a role to play to keep him alive in that moment...and he did it. Yeah the whole thing with how Coldhands became coldhands was great. I do wonder if it's BOOK TRUE too though. Guess we'll have to read and see one day. lol He didn't turn into a White Walker because the Children of the Forest stopped the "plague" from spreading too far. It must be a transitional phase when the night's king touches you and tries to turn you. The question is...why did they try to turn Benjen instead of just killing him like all other men? I'll comment more on the Children and if they're gone or not when I get to the rest of your comments.

Sam getting Heartsbane....yeah this was great. Essentially his whole trip home was to get that sword. Obviously there was some great character stuff in there too, but he'll need that sword in the dark times to come.

Yeah...Bran's vision could really be dissected for nuggets. Mad King ordering the Wildfire to be lit across the city and "BURN THEM ALL!!" ....visions of the dragons...ned getting beheaded....the tower of Joy (so we know it's in there so we will revisit at some point)....and Bran is now the 3 eyed raven and still downloading info and learning to control it.

Mike V. said...

I think we're meant to think Jaime has found a way to work around his deficiency in fights. I'm not exactly sure what's going to go down in riverrun, but I think they will at least pay homage to when Jaime visited the Blackfish in book 4. And SURELY with Frey coming back and reminding us of the Red Wedding...there is more that's going to happen to please book fans and show fans alike. (obviously I'm talking in riddles on purpose lol)

Funny with Arya and the sword vs. stick. But yes...she's totally killing Waif and giving Jaquen the face he demands. But then I think she's splitting town. I read some memes that followed Actress Cersei's speech at Actor Joffrey's death and it was really speaking to Arya's quest for vengence for her father's death...and the blame points squarely at Cersei herself. It was an effective MEME. I'll have to find it. lol

Like I said...i think the link to that page ALWAYS said they were extinct because Westeros BELIEVED them to be extinct. But, then we met Leaf. There's no telling if there are more hanging around somewhere. If anyone knows, I'm sure Coldhands does. He didn't say LEAF saved him. He said "The children of the forest" saved him. There was only one child in that cave right? Just Leaf right? I got confused because we saw the flashback in the same episode with LOTS of children...but I don't think they were there in the present day.

Yep...that Wall has to come down. I'm sure of it now. Obviously, it's a special time in the history of this show or Martin wouldn't have written a 7 book opus about it! LOL But yes...the Dragons do point to it being a special time. But, I would think a special time might point to the Children of the Forest coming out of hiding too (not being extinct...yet...kind of like the elves joining with men for the fight against the Sauron in LOTR lol) And yes...Jorah having greyscale may turn out to be a good thing for the war to come. Good point.

Mike V. said...

This is that arya meme I was referring to that is related to actress cersei 's speech

Mike V. said...

Saw there was a shot of Jaime on the Iron Throne in Bran's vision so I googled breakdowns of his whole vision. This girl Joanna Robinson knows her stuff. I listen to her podcasts too (Cast of Kings and Storm of Spoilers)

Anyway, so I'm friends with AUStarWars on facebook and he has a theory that Tommen will die and Jaime, based on the laws of succession (since he is no longer king's guard), may become king temporarily after Tommen dies. Not a bad thought....of course, the might get in the way of the LS theory though. lol I think the shot of Jaime on the throne was just the fact that that's how Ned found him when he came into the city after the Mad King was slain (granted he would've been a lot younger). Though, I do like AUSW's theory about "Burn them all"....he mentioned that it might be again due to Bran's accidental time meddling that he was trying to explain how to kill the wights or white walkers (maybe wildfire kills the walkers??) and he was saying burn them all and somehow connected with Aerys when doing so. Might explain why he went MAD. Not a bad theory.

Anonymous said...

Aerys being mad and burning re the white walkers--not a bad thought.

I don't see Jamie being in line of succession. Margery is queen and if Tommen dies, she would be the head ruler. AND would help explain her religious fervor-lol.

All the shots of the children have included the same 4 when they go wide shot. Go through and replay when Ben was stabbed and you'll see Leaf did both Ben and Night King.

Hodor's death was due to a selfish Bran which makes it somewhat senseless on its' own. The action of him dying to save Bran to only ended up having failed takes away from the sacrifice. A person is only saved from a threat when they are no longer being chased. That didn't happen until Ben came along. Ultimately Ben saved Bran and I'm good with that storyline. It's certainly true that Hodor helped save them too.

I am certainly in a minority but the Arya storyline to me is just not interesting. To begin with I don't like the idea of glorifying assassins. It is looking more and more like Arya will take out Cersei.

I think Sam learning to become a Maester is also going to be a big deal for the battle to come. It'll be interesting to see how they handle a woman there.

Yes, the wall is coming down, it's just a matter of when. I"m thinking next season. There are only 4 eps left and I think between Riverrun, Ramsay and Danny along with the Mountain defending Cersei and the Dorne girls there will be plenty of material.

I could see Cersei being taken out while Jamie is gone if it weren't for Arya.


Mike V. said...

I don't think the Westerosian lines of succession work that way. But I also don't necessarily agree with the Jaime taking the throne either. Interesting theory is all I observed. lol (I'm going to look up the lines of succession and will post)

Wait what??? We saw Benjen get stabbed? I thought he just talked about it. I watched it pretty late, but regardless....both of those shots weren't related to the present day CAVE where Bran was there with Meera, Hodor, the Raven and Leaf. I don't recall if anyone else was there.

Yeah but Hodor bought them enough time for Benjen/Coldhands to get there in time to save them. even if it was just a few was still enough time to be saved. They wouldn't have made it out there on their own just the 2 of them. And they had no idea where they were supposed to go next. They need a guide. PLUS....The RAVEN knew he was going to die in that vision with Bran. He had foreseen it just like Jojen saw his end coming. (it's a greenseer thing)....He is just as much responsible for what Bran did as Bran is. He put Bran in that position and even told Bran to listen to his friends because he knew it had to happen as it always had. We just have 2 different trains of thought on this (amongst many other things), so I don't expect you to convert your line of thinking. lol But, it worked for me and didn't diminish Hodor's tragic end/and retroactively tragic life for me.

Yep you're in a minority with Arya. I don't necessarily glorify assassins either...well not in real life. But Arya's quest for vengeance is a very interesting part of the books and the show for me. Even if you feel bad that Arya has chosen this path as her method of coping with a horrible string of luck...we support her and hope for the best with her and feel that justice will be hers one day. I love the conflict of feelings.

If Sam becoming a maester wasn't going to be a big deal I don't think GRRM would've sent him to the Citadel in the first place with his computer! lol Of course he's going to learn some key information that will help in the great battle. The dude likes to read!! In the books it's theorized he also possesses the horn of winter, but he definitely doesn't have it in the show. But for how they'll deal with Gilly, we'll have to wait and see. Surely, it can't be as bad as molestown!

I still think the wall coming down in the season 6 finale would be a great final shot of the season....of course I also wouldn't be surprised if they saved LS for a final shot too. But, you would think a final scene would be more thematic to the Ice/Fire grander scale battle than that story. lol

***************SPECULATION OF REMAINING EPISODES*************

- Arya vs. Waif

- Mountain vs. (I mean it has to be the hound right? Unless you're still thinking sand snakes) AKA CLEGANE BOWL

- Battle of the Bastards

- Riverrun drama

- Dany stuff....she makes it back to with Tyrion on what he's done in her absence...and the iron born show up with ships.....but surely there will be a conflict with Euron too in there somewhere. They still need to weed out the Sons of the Harpy too unless Tyrion's plan actually did 100% work. lol (That would be a little too clean wouldn't it???)

several of these things could happen in one episode, but you'd think they'd each be a setpiece for a climactic moment of an episode. (maybe not Arya vs. Waif)

Mike V. said...

I don't even need to look it up (still trying though). When King Robert Died, Cersei didn't become Queen of the 7 Kingdoms (I'm mean she technically became it because she took it but) went to Joffrey, but Ned claimed the rightful heir was Robert's Brother. (The children were illegitimate, but it wouldn't have been Cersei even if she was married by law to Robert) So I'm not sure why you'd think Margaery would become queen if Tommen dies. She didn't become queen when Joffrey died....of course she didn't seal the deal either (if you know what I mean)...but Cersei did with Robert and she still wasn't in the line of succession.

So that Jaime is freed from the King's guard he might be in the line of succession...but he's a Lannister where Tommen is a Baratheon so I'm not sure. I'll have to keep looking.

Anyway, I don't agree with the theory...just thought it was interesting enough to bring up.

Anonymous said...

Good point on JOffrey officially taking over for his Dad. But Tommen has no son and yes the earlier Margery wedding was not consummated.

Hard to believe that a Queen can't take over when no kids. And Ned's position was that it should be his brother. Tommen has no brother. AND Jamie isn't supposed to be related to Tommen. I'll grant you that with Tommen dead the succession could be a problem But, I think Margery could have a plan.


Anonymous said...

Some good ideas from the following link

This makes you think that the Children are gone since they gave it all.

Hodor coming back as a wight is indeed possible.


Anonymous said...

Maybe I'm imagining it but I thought we saw that girls face coming at someone when Ben was talking?

Mike V. said...

It wasn't Ned's position...Ned went by the letter of the law. If Robert had no true heirs than by law the throne should pass to Stannis. That would be the closest Baratheon heir. I looked up a bunch of stuff and it's actually never passed to a woman. (Which makes Dany usurping the throne pretty revolutionary by Westerosian standards. But she is the "last Targaryan" (quotes intentional).

Based on might vary by which family is on the throne. But it could be how each house lord succession works too. Female HEIRS can take the throne, but not wives.

I'll have to check the link out later. Blocked at work. I need to rewatch the scene but I think Benjen was just talking to Bran and Meera and he explained what happened to him which was similar to how the first white walker was created but then the Children got involved to stop the spreading. (kind of like Shireen's dragonscale stopped spreading too...)

Anonymous said...

I recall that GRRM patterned a lot of this show after British and French royalty of the middle ages more or less. And in some cases leading up to the rennaisance. In those periods and in the case of no CLEAR successer in all cases I can recall a fight broke out. And in GoT we have already had that happen after Robert died and his brothers claimed the throne along with a few others-lol. Given that, after Tommen's passing the possibility of conflict is very high and ultimately the throne will go to the one who wins the fight.


Mike V. said...

Yeah that's normally the case in Game of Thrones. Lines of succession don't matter much unless everyone is happy with the family ruling. The Targaryan reign lasted pretty long so they did have successors that weren't King by usurping the throne. And it always passes to a male heir with the family name. So with all of that, I don't really think Jaime is in line of succession. I didn't like that theory anyway.

On a somewhat related note have you seen all the debates going on on whether Dany will end up being a "Villain" of the story? We had discussed this previously. They're basing this all on her speech to the Dothraki at the end of the episode. That is motivating a horde and I don't see it much more than that. But, she will be coming into contact with characters that we've followed for the whole series and if she is in conflict with them things could get interesting. But with Dany and Tyrion on the same side I hardly think we'll be rooting against Dany (or I should say be "asked" to root against her). There are rarely things to root for or against in this show. The lines are blurred. Obviously, in the battle of the bastards we're meant to root for the Starks (as we are meant to root for the Starks in general). But in something like the Battle of Blackwater who were we exactly rooting for there? Basically, you root for individuals you like and are interested in the outcome of the battle. It's not like I wanted the Lannisters to win, but I wanted Tyrion to be okay.

This all goes to say...I don't think we'll be viewing Dany as a villain after all of this. Maybe it's too predictable to say she'll team up with Jon and they'll take on the white walkers but that would be satisfying. I could, however, see that being the route the show goes where the book may throw an additional twist in. Time will tell. (hopefully with the book lol)

Anonymous said...

HMMM. Very interesting re Dany and a villian--I've certainly never considered her someone I root for overall--several posts on that. Since I no longer really have a character I'm rooting for a lot I tend to have a much less vested perspective. Except in the story itself, the mythology, etc. Maybe I like Tyrion somewhat but I also like Jamie a little now that he's been humbled and educated-funny that they're both Lannisters. So, yes Dany will be by definition a villian to those who are in Westeros. Her intent is to simply conquer ALL of the 7 Kingdoms--that includes the Starks my friend. That makes her an enemy by her intentions, zero wiggle room unless she's willing to let kingdoms capitulate and come under her rule. AND, AND, AND we know she's a HORRIBLE ruler so that won't go well. IF,IF Tyrion becomes the defacto ruler in her place then again, so many won't like a Lanister ruling.

Look at it like this, she wants to break the wheel. A wheel that for most of memory has served people well, otherwise they would have broken it. For example the Targaryans.

Here's something to consider. For almost ALL of Westerosi history the Targaryans have ruled. It was THEIR WHEEL--HER wheel!!! So, I"m not so sure what she wants except to conquer and break things. I liken it to a child with a temper tantrum--lol. I got the slave thing. But conquering Westeros to become the ruler of the 7 Kingdoms is purely and simply because she feels like she's the rightful ruler. Regardless of what those in Westeros think.


MJ said...

I don't have time to catch up on comments here - and tomorrow is a new ep so not sure thre is much point - but have a few comments

Geez - online alot said they were not surprised that Benjen Stark was alive - but I was ! But is he alive ? Not sure what he is. Fabulous Dany riding in on the dragon !! So - is Maergery faking an alliance to the Sparrow - or has she fallen for what he is selling ? Is she doing this to save her brother who can't take much more ? Or is she making a power play by seeming to side with the Sparrow ? Or all the above ? Why Tommen is sending Jamie to Riverrun to take it for Frey is beyond me - other than to get the Starks and Jamie Lannister at the same location. Forgot all about Edmure being in Frey's dungeons though. Nice to see Gilly all clean and fancied up for once. I guess we are supposed to worry that Arya will be killed for not doing her task - but I doubt that will occur so hard to worry for her.

Mike V. said...

Sorry for the delay on these comments...we can continue the discussion in the new episode thread.

I think Dany may go in with the mindset of conquering but it may quickly change when she finds out what's going on over there with the White Walker threat and the dead marching down. I've just always assumed in the end we'd see all our favorites battling on the same side. Granted, that doesn't seem to be GRRM's maybe we'll be conflicted in who is pitted against whom. That said...if the Starks are up against Dany, I'm rooting for the Starks. lol I just don't see it going that way. I brought up the "break the wheel" analogy in my posts on the new episode as could apply to people from different houses working together for a cause.

We shall see.

@MJ - You know the rule MJ...if you don't see someone die...they're probably not dead! :) But yeah there's been lots of theories around Benjen from a book perspective. He might not be the character "coldhands" in the book (GRRM has confirmed this previously)....but it was a fan theory and it's the way they're going in the show. He's not quite dead, not quite alive I He's half wight or half white walker...i dunno!

Agree on everything else and we can catch up in the new episode thread!