Sunday, November 4, 2018

The Walking Dead: Season 9 Episode 5 - What Comes After

Hello all and welcome to the big one.  I haven't said this in a long time, but WOW!  That was a fantastic episode of The Walking Dead!  They pulled out all the stops for Rick's final episode on the show.  And they really had us all almost convinced that they were actually going to pull the trigger.  But everything perfectly came together in this episode and even ended up with something we discussed in our comments on a previous recap.   Then Talking Dead took things to another level with the announcement of future Walking Dead plans!  I'll try to cover it all after the jump!

Discussion Points

So many stuff happened in this episode.  Maggie had her confrontation with Michonne and Negan.  Jadis/Ann resolved her issues with the chopper people.  And Rick reflected on his journey from the beginning coming across friends long gone and had one final stand where he was able to save his "family".  

We knew Maggie wasn't going to be able to kill Negan, but it was shocking how it went down.  If he was putting on a performance for Maggie it was damn convincing.  But it looks like the 1.5 years (is this the first time we got a timeline update?) truly broke him.  He wants to be dead and with his wife and needed Maggie to do it.  Maggie and Michonne exchanged a knowing look when she came out with a pristine crowbar.  In the end Maggie finally saw things the way Rick did.  

Rick was in and out of consciousness, but was dead set on luring those walkers away from his friends.  He used his belt to get out of his impaling situation (didn't realize the wound was in same place as his original wound in the pilot).  He got to a cabin and bandaged himself up.  He ended up at the camp and got them to the bridge.  Andy Lincoln is on Talking Dead explaining how his encounters in the dreams were the wizard of Oz.  I already forget who was who but we saw: 
  • Shane - Great dialogue between these two.  Catching up on what was missed.  Shane showed pride that Rick brought out the rage at times on his journey.  And he needed him to do it again.  
  • Hershel - RIP Scott Wilson again.  Who knew they actually had him back on the show one more time?  Another great scene where he showed pride in how Maggie has fared on her journey and how strong she is.
  • Sasha - Stood on the corpses of the entire cast of the walking dead.  She sold the point that the show can go on without Rick.  He played his part.  And they're all in it together and are still with the survivors as they play their part.  They all get to the end together. 
  • BRIDGE DREAM - They fooled us with this one.   But he and Michonne got to have their final scene even if it was in his head.  
In the end, everyone came to help Rick and try and save him.  Rick took out the bridge with the dynamite and seemingly blew up with it.   It was clear that everyone else believes he is dead (which is the only way this would work.  We have discussed ad nauseam in the recap comments!).   

So, then there's Jadis.  She talks to the chopper people and gives her location.  She clearly was going to try and one up the chopper people since she didn't have an A but promised them one.  At the last minute, she saw walker bits traveling down the river and one Rick Grimes (a B!) still alive!  The show comes completely full circle and Rick gets on that chopper he saw way back in the beginning.  Jadis goes with him.   (more on this in a minute) 

Then we jump forward again in time and we see that No Maj from Fantastic Beasts slicing up walkers with another lady that looks familiar.  I didn't get any of their names and didn't rewind to write them down here.  But, I'm sure we'll learn them soon.  But someone came to their rescue. Her name?  Judith.   Judith Grimes with her daddy's hat and all!   Nice.  

So what on earth is going on?   Scott Gimple explained on Talking Dead.  He is in charge of all things DEAD (i.e. FTWD, TWD and now more) where Angela Kang has taken over show running duties for TWD.   So what's coming?  Rick Grimes movies straight to AMC with movie budgets and all!  It'll go beyond that.  They will be having mini series, different films.  Back stories for characters that are gone.  Stories all over the world.  When I first heard it, I'm thinking it might be a little much.  But the brand is still pretty popular so maybe they're onto something.  I'm totally in on the Rick Grimes movies though!  And even though they say his journey is done on TWD I still feel he'd come back for a series finale.  But, maybe the movies would cover any reunions needed.  

I didn't think I would say it, but I think I might be excited for more Walking Dead now!  It's been a pretty solid season 9 and this is one of the best episodes the show has ever done.  Let's see Judith kick some butt!   Let's chat in the comments.  Hope you enjoyed my ramblings and I'll see you next week! 


MJ said...

Didn't watch Talking yet - will tonight.

I think I'm pissed now. SIGH

They gave him a great ending and death - til they messed it up ! But - hey - I was right ! Jadis kidnapped him for the helicopter folks. And how was Gabe an A and Rick a B ? Hmmm. My husband thinks that A's die and B's don't so that is why she is saying B. She did have a think for Rick at one point. Course she liked Gabe too so I don't know.

I liked everything up to the kidnapping by Jadis. The flashbacks were well done. Catch that hand on his shoulder right after Hershel ? That was cool - Hershel's hand helping him stay on the horse. Was sad to see Hershel knowing the actor just passed. Did you notice he had both legs ? What a weird scene with all the dead bodies - some of them our gang. Odd that he saw Sasha though. But she was very 'Lostian' with what she said.

I liked the call outs to the Pilot. Not sure who it was that kept asking What's your wound ? Helo people maybe ? Loved Shane just saying outright that Judith was his kid. LOL Think I read that the music playing when on the copter was playing in the pilot when Glen first finds him in the tank.

I liked that him and Daryl had that tiny little scene where they kinda look eachother in the eye and say good bye.

And WTH with the time jump ? Like 5 years of time. So no way that they do a crossover with FTWD now !

And all of a sudden - out of nowhere - Negen is like mentally fragile ? With big patches of his hair missing from his head ? Just last week he was the same old Negen when he got into Michonnes head. This makes NO sense. And not sure I agree with you Mike that Maggie now sees things like Rick did - I think she just couldn't kick a puppy when it is down - and let him live in misery.

And oh - I did not realize the wound was in the same place either. Thanks for that. Wait - you didn't know that Hershel would be back for this episode ? It was announced after his death.

Read in an article that 4 of the 5 newbies are Magna, Yumiko, Connie, and Luke. Means nothing to me.

Wait - the guy who can't get enough Star Wars and Hero movies and shows is talking about over-saturation ? LOL Too funny. LOL on the now maybe being excited for the show.

Plumbarius said...

I'm back! Been awhile since I commented...last season finale, probably.

I'm with MJ, loved everything up till the point that Rick DOESN'T DIE! I had a couple of theories about how he dies, including Maggie killing him to get to Negan or Rick sacrificing himself to save Negan. I did not envision anything close to what actually happened.
It was cool hearing that same music that was heard during the pilot!
The new characters at the end are in comics, BTW

Not sure how I feel about TWD movies, how do you keep a recovered Rick Grimes away from his people?? Particularly after a looooong time jump in the upcoming episodes.

Great interaction with the former cast members. I remember reading last spring that they were spotted on set and speculation about their role in S-9. Shane "does she have my eyes"? Rick-"at least she doesn't have your nose" LOL

I do like this season so far, now that Gimble is no longer directly in charge...Angela Kang is doing a great job.

As I said several times, FTWD has actually become the better show, hopefully S-9 of TWD recovers and finds its mojo going forward.

Mike V. said...

That’s hilarious. I’ve been anti-TWD for the past 2-3 years and then I finally love an episode and you guys are slamming it! Lol Look….they had me fooled. I knew I should’ve stuck to my guns but I got cold feet after last week. I was on my high horse saying they will NOT kill Rick. And they didn’t! But they got him off the show in the best way possible. Everyone else thinks he’s dead! (at least we think so)

I’ll give you that…it was a great ending and death. They wrapped it up in a way that really sold his end. But, it seems like they had this plan in the works for awhile. Even when they talked about “killing him off” last year it was the same thing…he’d be choppered off. That chopper has been lingering around every now and then. And now we know why. (and yes good call MJ on the chopper! Once you said it I knew that sounded like a really good way for it to happen) I did catch that hand over the shoulder! That was crazy! Sasha’s words were VERY lostian.

Okay…I actually have a meeting at 11 so I’m gonna have to write more later…but I’ve ALWAYS been worried about oversaturation with Star Wars AND Marvel. Lol I think CW has gone too far with their stuff. Even Netflix. Just can’t keep up. Star Wars is a different kind of brand and you need to treat it with care. After the Solo flop, they’re taking a step back and rethinking which makes sense. But it’s unfortunate because even though I’m worried about oversaturation I was really looking forward to an obi-wan film! (fingers crossed it still happens)

Okay…definitely will comment on everything more later!

MJ said...

LOL on me needing 'to treat it with care'

Well - Rick could still die though. The movie - from my understanding of what I am reading since I haven't watched Talking yet - is that it will tell the story of what happened to Rick with the Copter people. So he could still die.

I didn't hate it - just was mad they didn't just pull the trigger. But now we know why - movies and such.

Good to know they are in the books ! Thanks. And yeah - FTWD had a fab season - but I don't want them to crossover to be honest. And funny that they had to get rid of a bounc or core chars to make it better. Just saying. I do NOT miss Nick.

Mike V. said...

Sorry about that. Was typing quickly. I’ll go through everything now.

Back to MJ comments – Jadis…yeah I wonder if she’ll be off TWD now too and be in the first movie? Hershel -yep also noticed the both legs.
I thought multiple people asked about the wound. The nods to Judith being Shane’s kid were hilarious. Nice on the music. That makes sense.
The Darl/Rick goodbye was great.
I think Plumb might say this but I think this time jump is in the comics. And they did say the whisperers storyline is coming.
I think Negan was putting up a front to try and get someone to kill him. When Maggie wouldn’t do it, that’s when he lost is hard exterior. He also said “I tried”…I think he had been trying to kill himself but couldn’t. Not sure how that impacted his hair though. Lol Maybe Maggie doesn’t see things the way Rick did 100%, but she has more appreciation for his decision. I’m pretty sure Rick knew imprisonment would break Negan. Maybe not to the extent it did…
I had no idea Hershel would be back. Don’t think I read it.
Thanks for the names of the newbs. I recognize the one guy from Fantastic Beasts and the main girl is from The 100.
To your second responses….oh no I wasn’t saying YOU need to treat the SW franchise with care. I meant…YOU as in Disney/everyone lol But I can see why that would’ve been confusing in hindsight. Lol
The movies (3) are to open up the TWD world and show the much larger impact. We’ve been on the ground with 2 groups (in the 2 shows) seeing their day to day struggles. With a movie you could open it up and show world implications….maybe even show the origin of the virus. The stuff we’ve always been wondering about. I’m guessing these chopper people are more connected to that larger scheme and Rick will be going into JACK BAUER mode. He’s a “strong one”….someone they can use in the larger fight. But yes..he could still die. But not until the end of the 3rd film. Lol There’s tons of articles on it now, but yeah just watch Talking Dead and they’ll explain it for you!
@Plumb – welcome back! Yeah I think Judith is playing Carl’s role essentially in the comic story. BTW…did we hear on TD that the actress played Young Rey in The Force Awakens? Good times. Lol She had like one line in a flashback. I’m sure movie will cover why Rick can’t go back. There’s still a recovery period…and then maybe there are rules and he can’t go back or something. He won’t be top guy on the totem pole either in this new organization…I would assume.

Agreed on Kang vs. Gimple. Though Gimple did co-write this episode.
I’m sure FTWD is a good show. I just don’t have time for it! A 2 hour movie? I can do….16 episode season of another show? I’m out. lol

Mike V. said...

ugh sorry for the spacing. copy pasted from another application!

MJ said...

Hershel - Oh I read that him and Shane would be back and when the actor died they stated that they had already filmed it.

I'm hoping the movies do some flash backs a la Lost. In the early days of this show I always wondered what some of these peoples lives were like prior to it all going to hell. Like Andrea and her sister. Or Glenn. Even Tyreese and Sasha. Love to see Abraham in the past too.

Mike V. said...

I knew Shane would be back. Maybe I read Hershel and didn't think about it at the time when he died. I have a lot going on in my head these days. Not everything sticks there anymore! lol

Yeah that would be cool to see some flashbacks. Those are all great ideas. I forgot about all of those characters it's been so long. It would be cool to spend some more time with them.

Anonymous said...

Just read that Sunday was also Maggies final ep. For now at least. If her show bombs she might be back. But damn - not explaining her absence - just not showing her on the show. Weird

Jason B. said...

Hey guys, I've been so busy with school the past few weeks that I haven't had the time to come and read these.

I loved seeing the old characters that appeared, although Angela Kang had already announced that all three of them were appearing. So I was hoping there would be more that would actually be a surprise. But since Rick ended up not actually dying I'm more okay with it. I'm sure they would have gone even more all-out if he had.

At first I wondered why Sasha for the final appearance, but knowing that she sacrificed herself for the group and seeing that Rick ended up (almost) doing the same thing, it made a lot more sense.

The crew had a lot of body doubles and even full dummies for old characters, so if you look closely in the body scene you can see characters like Tyreese, Beth, and Dale. Greg Nicotero talked about there being even more than that (like Glenn, Sophia, and more), but those are the ones I was able to find. Plus almost the entire main current cast is in there somewhere. That whole scene was based off of a comic cover variant, so that was really cool. If you image search "twd issue 100 variant" it's pretty easy to find, although there are multiple others.

The "what's your wound?" line was originally Morgan's line back in the pilot. So in this episode he was the first to say it, in the hospital room scene. Then each following character saying it had some relation to the person Rick was about to hallucinate. Lori said it right before he saw Shane, Beth said it right before he saw Hershel, and Abraham said it right before he saw Sasha. I'm positive that Lori's and Abraham's lines were voiced by the actual actors, I'm guessing Beth's was too but I haven't heard for sure.

When they revealed that Rick didn't actually die, my first thought was that you called it Mike haha. Since I hadn't read the last two recaps I didn't know you changed your mind, but either way you called it originally.

My thought is that Rick was taken overseas. That would best explain why he wasn't able to return within 6 years, as he'd have no way of getting back by himself. Plus if it's more specifically in the UK, if they film the movie(s) there Andrew would be much closer to home.

Yeah, based on the hints they dropped in the first few episodes, I'm guessing Maggie finally gave in to Georgie's request to come to her community. So that's where she'll be the rest of this season. Someone will likely mention it next episode, but that's probably all we'll get for now.

As far as FTWD goes, I didn't enjoy season 4 very much at all. Especially the second half. I enjoyed most of the new characters (definitely not "The Filthy Lady" Martha though lol) and Morgan is one of my favorites from TWD, but having really loved seasons 1-3 and knowing what Dave Erickson's original long term goals were made me really bummed out seeing how much they changed it all. I probably would have enjoyed it a lot more if it were a separate spin-off show and the real FTWD season 4 was still coming. It felt like a separate show anyway. I'll probably still end up watching season 5, but by the end of this season I was honestly wishing that they would just head to Alexandria and end that show. When Colony was cancelled I was like really? This show doesn't get a season 4 but FTWD gets a season 5? Not fair haha.

Mike V. said...

Hi Anonymous - I tried to respond on my phone last night to this but it wasn't working right. Yeah I assumed that would be the end of Maggie's arc as well even though they didn't publicize it. But she has done an interview recently that she's thrilled with Angela Kang's direction of the show and would love to come back. I'm sure they'll cover why she's missing in these upcoming episodes. My best guess, she's working with Pants suit lady (whom I've dubbed Ellen DeGeneres much to MJ's chagrin lol) and spreading the word of building up civilization again. But I really have no idea!

Hi Jay! You've been noticeably missed, but understand on being busy. It's why I'm usually whining about having to write the recap and continue watching the show as it is. But somehow Rick's final arc here has inspired me a little. It was a great send-off. We'll see how long my new honeymoon period lasts!

MJ mentioned those character appearances were announced ahead of time as well...I knew about Shane...maybe I even knew about Sasha. Totally forgot about Hershel if I knew.

Yeah makes a lot of sense with Sasha agreed. Still not sure I get the Wizard of Oz allegory with Scarecrow, Tinman and Lion. Courage, heart and brains/wisdom (Hershel?). I could go either way with the other 2 for Shane and Sasha. Maybe it had to do with their messages in that episode in particular. Shane was saying to bring the rage back. Is that courage? Sasha was talking about how all their lives matter in the end and they're all doing this together. HEART? I's kinda weak. But whatever....I've always said the symbolism and metaphors on this show were fairly weak.... lol

Thanks on the "calling it originally" comment! I appreciate that. lol I always had a sliver a doubt that they'd pull the trigger on it (with my "the main star always will return for a series finale" theory). But they had me pretty convinced by the end of the episode. I was even wondering near the end..."I wonder why they decided to include Jadis/Anne's story in this episode? Doesn't seem very relevant" lol Totally forgetting MJ's theory that he could end up on that chopper at the end. That's just the power of this episode in comparison to prior eps. They pulled out all the stops in this one. One of Top 5 eps for sure.

I would put money on Overseas as well for Rick. Especially if airlines are down...and he has to ship it over there? Nice call on UK and being local for Andy. Totally makes sense!

AHHH GEORGIE!!!! That's her name! lol At least we're on the same page (can you tell I'm reading the comments as I'm typing? This is who I meant by Ellen D. up above)

FTWD - Not even going to try to read that as I'm lost. I'm out of the loop!

Thanks for the comments all! This blog always works better when we have discussions. Though....I do appreciate the slower pace than when LOST Addicts Blog was going full steam. It was fun, but didn't make me very productive at work! :) (I'm kidding company sensors! I did plenty!!!)

MJ said...

I was Anonymous posting about Maggie. clicked Anonymous by accident. ;-P

Cause she is nothing like Ellen ! LOL

I don't recall hearing about Sasha - just Shane and Hershel.

FTWD - yeah I didn't like Dirty lady either. But like rest of season a lot. Love the new characters.

Rick could def be taken over seas - or just to some boat in the ocean - which would stop him from getting back. And I mean a big boat - like Navy or even a cruise ship - not a personal boat like in FTWD