Monday, July 24, 2017

Game of Thrones: Season 7 Episode 2 - Stormborn

Hello friends and welcome back for more Game of Thrones talk!  We're 2 episodes into season 7 and are moving at a rapid fire pace.  Ravens are flying left and right, characters who have been in separate arcs all series are intersecting and things couldn't be more exciting.   I'm not going to waste much time in this preamble because there's much to discuss.  So let's dive in!

Discussion Points


Born on a night very much like the stormy night hitting Dragonstone in this episode, Dany makes her first moves to take the 7 kingdoms.

  • Dany is brought up to speed on Cersei's position and how she's despised across Westeros.  Dany refuses to believe that people will openly accept her if she conquers King's Landing and leaves it in ashes.  This is also Tyrion's advice to her as well.  It's also the advice that was given to Maximus in Gladiator.  Win the crowd!  
  • Dany takes some time to talk to Varys for the first time ever.  She recaps all of his wheeling and dealings from season 1 to present.  He's been a free agent is whole career trying to stay alive and supporting the realm.  But she doesn't want to be the next victim of backstabbing.  She knows she played a part in marrying her off to Kahl Drogo, and also helping King Robert with the assassination attempt on Dany.  Tyrion attempted to aid Varys in the verbal beatdown, but he had to pretty much take it.  He did tell her that he chooses her. He sweated loyalty to her and to address any concerns he has in her ruling along the way.  But, in a tip of the hat to her father, she threatened to burn him alive if he ever betrays her.  
  • Not to waste too much time Melissandre has returned to Dragonstone to meet with the dragon queen. She speaks in high Valayrian about how she rose fro slavery and is honored to meet the breaker of chains. She speaks to how those who do not follow the Lord of Light can still serve. She speaks of the prophecy of The Prince That Would Be Promised.  We've spoken of this theory many times over the years (in spoiler sections and now out in the open).  The theory overlaps with Azor Ahai speaking of the person/persons who will bring an end to the Long Night.  Jon and Dany come up in these theories many times.  Most of the time I've leaned on the idea that it could be both of them.  And this episode adds credit to that theory (which probably means it's wrong!!).  Anyway, Missendi mentions that the translation of "PRINCE" is gender neutral and doesn't necessarily refer to a man.   But bottom line, Melissandre urges Dany to meet with Jon Snow.  (Wait what?? It's actually happening!??  After all this time?  Chills folks!!)   Just as we discussed, the fact that Tyrion is there to hear this allows him to vouch for the young man he escorted up the King's Road to Castle Black and the Wall.  They bonded over being bastards and imps.  Tyrion was surprised to find out that Jon is King of the North and all of his other accomplishments.   I love how news only travels freely when it isn't needed to serve as shock value!  (Cersei has her whisperers but she knew absolutely everything, The Citadel didn't know that there has been a change in regime at The Wall, but Hotpie knows that Jon Snow is King of the North and victor of The Battle of the Bastards!   Granted....I'm sure the Inn at the Crossroads allows him to hear all kinds of crazy stories from travelers.)   
  • Dany agrees to meet with Jon Snow and asks Tyrion to draft up a message for the raven.  But she also asks that he comes and bends the knee.  I foresee a rocky start to Dany and Jon's relationship.  But, there is so much to be unveiled over these coming episodes.  The immediate appeal of an alliance is a given.  But, what happens when Jon finds out who he really is?  When Dany finds out who he really is?  And what will happen when they've already forged an alliance through marriage and find out that she's his aunt?  (I kid!! But do I?)  
  • Once all the allied ladies are summoned, the battle plans are discussed.  Ellaria Sand, Lady Olenna Tyrell and Yara Greyjoy all want to take King's Landing by fire.  But Tyrion is advising a different approach (as mentioned above).  Lots of one liners were thrown back and forth between Tyrion and Ellaria on their prior family encounters.  (i.e. Myrcella Lannister's poisoning, Oberyn dying for Tyrion)   Botton line, Dany does not want to be queen of ashes.  The plan is for the Greyjoys and Sands to go South to Dorne and take King's Landing from the South with the Martell clan heading from another direction.   The Dothraki and Unsullied will seize Casterly Rock in the Westerlands.  We finally get to see the ROCK!  Haven't even gotten there in the books yet.  Everyone agrees to this approach.  
  • I'll make short note of the other scene.  Missendi and Grey Worm finally reveal their true feelings for each other.  Grey Worm has fear now.  Fear of losing her.  They get down to business and we're thankfully spared from seeing Grey Worm's umm..non-worm.  I always was rooting for those 2! 
  • We should also note that Olenna had to put down the man and tell Dany what's up.  She said she's outlived all wise men (referring to Tyrion advising Dany) because she's ignored them all.  She told Dany, "You're the dragon.  Be the Dragon."  Wise, but risky advice to the Mad King's daughter!  


Wasting no time, the raven has already arrived with Dany's request of Jon Snow.  But it's not the only raven that arrives.  Conveniently enough, all the northern lords are still hanging out in the Winterfell hall just waiting for Jon to come in and give more speeches! (seriously, do you think they filmed them all in one day?)

  • Jon reads Tyrion's message with Sansa and truly asks for her opinion.  Tyrion included something he told Jon on the way to the wall, "All dwarfs are bastards in their father's eyes" to prove it was him and remind him of their bond.  A means of establishing trust.  Sansa concurred that Tyrion was always nice to her and different than the rest of the Lannister Clan but she opposes Jon leaving Winterfell.  Too dangerous.  
  • Davos is quick to make the connection that Dragons could be valuable in the war against the White Walkers and wights.  (Well duh!!! Us viewers and readers have only been talking about that for decades!)  
  • Shortly after Sam's message comes from the Citadel.  (I guess they got the raven about Jon being in Winterfell now even though they didn't get too many messages from The Wall!)  Jon now has more reason to go to Dragonstone.  There is proof that there is a mountain if dragonglass there.  It will also be an opportunity to align with Dany and inform her about the coming storm from the North.  
  • Enter the Hall to convince the other Lords of the North.  Sansa again breaks the unifying front to question Jon reminding him that their grandfather (and Ned's brothers) marched south prior to Robert's Rebellion and were killed by the Mad King.  She thinks it's a trap.  Lord Royce of the Vale spoke up in agreement with Sansa.  Even Lady Mormont spoke out against Jon this time.  But Jon, the reluctant king, still heading Maester Aemon's words to BE THE MAN plans to do what he knows is right.  
  • Jon eases some of the tension by placing Sansa in charge of Winterfell.  All of these moves are to Littlefinger's delight.  What moves is he planning now?  We'll see.   And with Bran on the move South and Arya moving North (spoiler alert, didn't quite cover that yet) the excitement and potential dread is real! 
  • Jon goes to the crypt to see his "father" before he heads out with Davos to Dragonstone.  Who but Littlefinger comes in saying creepy things like he loves Jon's sister just like he loved Catelyn Stark.  Littlefinger did ask for a thank you for the aid at the battle, but the sister comment set Jon off and he choked Petyr out and threaten to kill him if he goes near Sansa.  Here's the problem Jon, you're not going to be there and Petyr moves fast!  Don't you remember how he got to King's Landing in like an hour from Winterfell when it took King Robert and crew months?  (I know I know, the show isn't moving at a set pace, but my jokes are coming to me at an all time high pace)
  • Sidenote: I really thought Littlefinger was going to reveal something about Jon's parentage here, but that would be an underwhelming way to reveal it to him.  But, this is an opportunity to say OF COURSE Jon is leaving when Bran is trying to get to him!  Surely, Jon will find out this season about that.  But we'll see. 
  • We end this sequence with Jon and Davos ready to head out.  Jon gives a wave to Sansa and she waves back.  Littlefinger comes out of the crypt holding his neck but a little pleased with the developments.  The only thing we can hope here is that when Sansa says she knows what he wants that she knows how to keep him in his place too.   

Kings Landing

Cersei is trying to rally houses to her cause.  And her best attempt in doing so?  Spreading lies about the invading dragon queen.

  • Cersei refers to Dany as the Mad King's daughter.  She mixes in some truth about what will happen when Dany invades.  The Dothraki will conquer and rape.  Well we've seen that before so not much of a stretch.  But, under Dany we know she'll try to rein that in.  But then Cersei starts spreading tales of how Dany was feeding people to dragons in Slaver's Bay.  
  • The only one of note that Cersei is speaking to is Samwell Tarly's father Randyll.  (and of course, his other son the hilariously named 'Dickon')  Randyll is not a fan of Oathbreaking and calls out Jaime on his role in Robert's Rebellion as well as his family's role in the Red Wedding.   Randyll has an Oath to support Lady Olenna.  Jaime tries to convince Randyll that Lady Olenna is fueled by revenge and also entices him by making him Warden of the South.  We don't get an answer in this episode, but we can guess which way he'll lean. 
  • Qyburn spoke about working on some anti-nuke errr Dragon weapons and then showed Cersei a little later.  We visited the dungeon where we saw Arya in season one eavesdropping on Varys and Illyrio and of course where Aegon Targaryan kept his dragons after they conquered Westeros.  Qyburn shows Cersei the skull of Valerion, the dragon Aegon rode to conquer the 7 kingdoms.  He also knew of Drogon's injury in the fighting pits from the spears.  This was enough to know that dragons are not invulnerable.  We see this weapon pierce the skull of Valerion.   Why do I get the feeling we may lose one dragon this season?  

Oldtowne - Citadel

  • So it appears the Archmaester is collecting some of the best historical records from the library as inspiration for his own novel chronocling the events that have occurred since the death of King Robert the First.  Sam wasn't thrilled with whatever name he came up with for the book.  There are some rumors that this show may end with Sam writing and naming the Song of Ice and Fire.  Afterall, George R. R. Martin has once said that most closely identifies with Samwell in the books (even though, he'd ideally want to be Tyrion).  
  • The rest of Sam's time in this episode focuses on Sam wanting to help Jorah get cured.  The archmaester thinks he's a lost cause.  Jorah will live for 10-20 more years but he has 6 months or fewer with hi mind intact.   Sam continues to question this due to meeting Shireen Baratheon.  The archmaester knew all about Shireen and Maester Kresson's treatment of the dragonscale, but it was caught much earlier on.  
  • Once Sam found out Jorah was Jeor "Old Bear" Mormont, former Lord Commander of the Night's Watch, he was determined to help him.  Sam found a book of treatment for rare diseases, which the current archmaester ironically indicated that the author, Archmaester Pylon, died of greyscale.  This didn't stop Sam's determination.  He brought the medical equipment and Rum to try and save Jorah.  Sam taking a swig for himself was hilarious!  This scene was incredibly difficult to watch, but I have to give them credit for the awesome transition into an Arya scene at the Inn at the Crossroads!  
  • I also have to say that this cure will probably work or at least give Jorah a little more time to take part in the rest of this war.    

  • Arya arrives at the Inn and runs into Hot Pie! He updates her on Brienne and how he sent her after Arya.  Arya is acting cold and calculated, but making time for Hot Pie's awesome bread and some ale.  She is still determined to go to King's Landing.  As I mentioned, Hot Pie is a wealth of knowledge of events that have gone down.  He knew Cersei blew up the Sept of Baelor.  And he also knew about Jon fighting in the Battle of the Bastards and becoming King of the North.  I guess with Arya on the run there's a good chance she did not know about this yet.  And of course, it made for an emotional reveal when she found out and had to make a decision on whether to continue to King's Landing or go home.  And I think if you weren't standing up and cheering like me when she did make the decision to go home, you were doing it in your head! 
  • Enroute to Winterfell, Arya stops to build a fire.  At first I thought her horse was going to freeze to death.  But as the scene lingered and I recalled that she's near the Inn where she had to let her Direwolf go, I knew Nymeria was coming.  And, man I got the chills!  Nymeria showed up with her pack of wolves.  This is a reference to the books.  Arya (and all of the Starks) would all have wolf dreams in the books, not just Bran.  And she would dream of Nymeria running with a pack of Wolves who were attacking Freys and other enemies of the Starks/Arya. 
  • This scene clearly indicates there is a connection and that the wolves still take after their owners.  When Arya tells her she's returning home, finally back to Winterfell, Nymeria lingers a bit.  But, in the end, Arya knows Nymeria isn't going to come.  The line "That's not you" is a callback to season 1 when Ned was talking to Arya about how she'll marry a great lord one day and have lots of children who will be lords and knights and what not.  Arya said, "that's not me."  Arya is not domesticated and her wolf should not be either.  For the record, I didn't come up with this on my own, it was on the "inside the episode" with the show runners on HBO GO. So, it was exciting to see Nymeria again, but said she isn't joining Arya.  That said, something tells me we may see her and her pack again at some point. 

Voyage to Dorne
  • The Greyjoys and Martells are heading to Dorne via sea.  Sand Snakes are talking about who they're going to kill.  The Mountain, Cersei, etc... 
  • Long story short, Yara and Ellaria both realize they're into women so things move rapidly and Theon gets all awkward again.  This doesn't last long as they are invaded by Euron.  
  • We get a grand fiery night battle at sea where we get to see Euron show what he's capable (instead of just hearing him talk about it).  Once the battle started I started calculated in my head who can be sacrificed at this stage in the game.  All that I could come up with were Sand snakes!  
  • I know there's Obara and the girl from Iron Fist (who had some scheduling conflicts but was able to come back to film this).  They both got in some kills before they were ultimately killed. Tyene was sent to protect Ellaria.  I believe she is still alive.  (She was the one that flirted with and poisoned Bronn a couple seasons back)  
  • The key moment in the battle was a standoff between Euron with a knife to Yara's throat and Theon.  Theon reverted back into Reek mode and did not have the courage to try and take Euron on.  Euron reveled in Theon's fear and betrayal of Yara.  Worse yet, Theon jumped overboard and bailed from the entire situation.  
  • From what I can gather, Euron has captured Ellaria, Tyene and Yara.  I can see Ellaria and Tyene being prizes for Cersei since they conspired to kill Myrcella Lannister.  Yara may be a personal prize to Euron.  
  • As the ship sailed away and Theon sulked in the water, all I could think was maybe Gendry will row past and pick him up?   
So, another exciting and informative episode in the books.  I still am having a hard time processing the fact that we're actually experiencing moments that we've only been able to talk and speculate about from a book and show perspective.  It is extreme payoff time for our investment.  Let's savor every moment!  I'm looking forward to discussing in the comments with you all.  Hope you enjoyed my ramblings and I'll see you next week! 


Anonymous said...

YOu do a good job, thanks.

Greyjoys--it's hilarious for me to read this morning how the Greyjoy's were attacked. Euron is the duly chosen King of the Iron Borne. Yara wasn't chosen, she's a rebel. I've read a couple of sites this morning and it's just nuts how they go with Yara's perspective. It was stupid for Euron to let Yara live. Cersei won't really care about her. But, Cersei will want Ellaria and the Snake girl for killing Myrcella--so will Jamie. I can't wait for them to be killed btw. The best thing Ellaria and her snakes are good for is to root against, at least for me.

Dragonstone--So, Tyrion's plan will be obviously viewed as a failure and Ollena's direction looks more like the one Dany will take. BTW, I used to enjoy watching Tyrion, he was one of the key characters to watch. Now, not so much. Actually the last several eps have his character very much less interesting. Lately, he's just been a typical hand--a LOT more a** kissing than Ned. It occured to me last night that he's probably changed as much if not more than any other character. He's basically grown up and accepted his position as a cog in the wheel.

Dany, speaking of the wheel. Have you noticed how much Dany is talking like a power hungry wheel loving monarch lately. The difference between Jon's not wanting the crown and Dany saying she was born to rule,etc was striking in this ep. Especially when she said Jon would have to bend the knee. Doesn't sound like a wheel breaker to me. And what Cersei said about the bad things Dany did wasn't really a lie. It's all about the perspective. Which goes back to what I said about the Greyjoys.

So, the first battle at Eastwatch vs the WW may not include Jon? I'm not sure about travel times any more but there are 5 eps left and Dragonstone is a pretty good ways from Winterfell and Eastwatch is a really long haul from Dragonstone. There's only 11 eps left in the entire series btw. It's a shame it may take us 2 years to get there though.

JOn meeting Dany-- will he bend a kneee? I'm thinking he doesn't care if he does or not as long as he can get the dragonglass and have her to help him fight the WW. But, she's going to want to go to KL first and so there's the tension I've been expecting. And I still believe she's going to KL firs and in the meantime those in the North are going to fight at Eastwatch/the Wall vs the WW. I'm just not sure what Jon will be doing during those battles(he may not even be King for long,see below). Will he be spending his time still trying to convince Dany or go North to fight? Davos will see Melissandre again in Dragonstone. BTW, she sure didn't seem convinced of anything re the lord of light and the prophecies. Actually Dany fighting in KL loosing a dragon or 2 would be good for her and the show. She's power hungry and pretty much believes her own press. And yes I love Qyborn's dragon killer! It makes the fight interesting.

2 part post, rest following,Richard

Anonymous said...

Rest of Post from above.

I find it a convience that word of Bran has not yet reached Winterfell but 2 other Ravens have. Because when it does, Jon's reign is going to be challenged. Jon being gone opens up an opportunity for Bran to arrive in Winterfell while Sansa is in control with Petyr still there and also Arya showing up. Which could prove interesting as to power struggles. I could easily imagine the lords and ladys of the North swinging away from Jon since he "abandoned" them to go SOUTH while the threat is to the NORTH. Petyr of course will be at work. AND, AND, AND Bran knows Jon is NOT a Stark!!! WE believe Petyr suspects this too. I don't think Bran will be looking for the crown either and so will provide a path for Sansa. Understatement--it will be hard for Jon to maintain his crown as King of the North. BUT, eventually his Targaryan heritage will come out and his position may be improved eventually. Of course, he doesn't care about such things as ruling. Maybe he could play a Theon role and support Dany, LOL.

Back to Euron--I love how he so quickly defeated the Greyjoy pretenders, his brashness and swager make him fun to watch. A character type in some ways Tyrion, Jamie or Obyron used to fill and is needed to help make the show fun.

I wonder if Ser Davos will take to the sea now to fight Euron?


Anonymous said...

Re Dany, the power loving monarch now. I say that in part because of things like the line she had basically saying--"this is not the homecoming I expected". Wait, she's in her ancestoral home, worshipped by all those around her and she's not happy with her circumstances. It's like she expected the people of Westeros to put out the welcome mat. While she brought the dothraki, unsullied and dragons--quite a culture shock for those in Westeros.


Mike V. said...

Thanks Richard. Definitely was the most effort I’ve put into one of those in awhile. Not sure I can keep it up. Lol

Greyjoys – You should like Barney from How I Met Your Mother when he viewed the antagonist of every story as the hero. Lol People are sympathizing with Yara because the show has designed her as the one we support. Why do we support the rebellion against the empire in Star Wars? Because we’re following it from their perspective. There are lots of people working for the empire who have no idea how tyrannical Emperor Palpatine is. Lol Anyway, I digress. Euron is the chosen king and he’s trying to align with Cersei and vowed to bring her a prize. And yes, as I also mentioned the prize is Ellaria and Tyene for the Myrcella killing. Yara is essentially Euron’s prize. You have to remember though..Euron did kill Balon Greyjoy to take the salt throne (or whatever they call it)….even though we didn’t like Balon either he was Yara and Theon’s father. And Yara was groomed to lead her people. (still hate that they changed her name from Asha in the books)

Dragonstone – I see your point on Tyrion, but I don’t think that position as “cog in the wheel” will last. Once he comes into contact with his siblings, things are going to get interesting. But yeah…once the writers ran out of GRRM’s plans for Tyrion, I think they’ve struggled to keep his master mindedness going as well as they used to. His plans to rule Meereen while Dany was away were flawed, and intentionally flawed but it was hard to believe that Tyrion wouldn’t have come up with something better. Yes, I think all the references to the Mad Queen are intentional with Dany. I’m sure she might go too far at one point, but I really don’t think they’re setting her out to be the villain of the story this late in the game. I think it’s just one of her internal conflicts she’ll need to sort out. I think Jon and Dany will have their issues and it’ll be interesting what’ll happen when Jon’s lineage is revealed.

Eastwatch – Not sure if you noticed, but people are traveling a lot more quickly these days. That said…I don’t know if Jon will be at Eastwatch. I guess he could fly a dragon there. Lol I’m not going to get into the logistics it takes to film these episodes again. HBO may be part to blame but they took the same amount of time to film these 7 episodes that they did the 10 in previous seasons. And the run time of the entire season might surpass the run time of a usual 10 episode season. Or it’s close. And next year (or 2018) the rumors are the episodes will all be feature length (like an hour and 30 minutes). Probably not but I could see a few of them being that long. And they’re still throwing the same time and money at the show with less episodes. It takes them all year to produce these shows. Okay, I guess I did get into the logistics again. Lol
Jon meeting Dany – I don’t know if Jon will bend the knee. Tyrion may help if there is tension. But I think he will tell his story and it may change Dany’s motives…maybe not immediately. I’m interested to see how it goes. But yes…is Melissandre still there? Because if Davos sees her it won’t be good. But I think she won’t die until Arya and her meet again.

Gotta run to a meeting so I’ll get to your 2nd 2 posts later!

Mike V. said...

Bran/Winterfell stuff - right. I mentioned similar conflicts and the fact that littlefinger will be there to meddle with it all too. It definitely isn't a coincidence. Not sure if we'll have time at the wall with Bran or if he'll go straight to Winterfell.

Dany - She actually said the contrary about the welcome mat. She told Varys that Viserys believed people were secretly waiting for their arrival and she's not that naïve. She just said Dragonstone doesn't feel like home. That's a little different than it not being the homecoming she expected.

Davos vs. Euron? Guess it depends who fights with whom. Will Jon unite with Dany to take down Cersei? Will dany be on iron throne first to HELP with the White Walker threat from there? We know those Dragons will scorch the Red Keep if the vision in season 2 is to remain true.

Okay, meeting time!

Anonymous said...

Oh yea, the dragons will fire up KL. Which btw, has shades of the mad king AND Cersei-- lol.


Mike V. said...

Of course, it could be misdirection. Prophecies are always misread afterall. We’ve seen Cersei willing to take her own life before surrender to invading armies. She may light the cache of wildfire under the red keep before Dany even has a chance to invade with the dragons.

Anonymous said...

It could be both at KL, dragons and wildfire. I am looking forward to Qyborn killing at least 1 dragon.

There is zero chance of Jon going with Dany to take down Cersei. At least if the show and his character maintain any credibility. He is totally committed to fighting the threat from the North and pretty soon he's not going to have an army. And even if he did have an army there is no way they would go all the way to KL for him now. Not after they have bought into the WW threat. So, without an army, what good is Jon anyway?

Still no Bravos stuff.

Your point about GRRM and him writing Tyrion is great. GRRM has said he likes that character. And without GRRM writing the character any more, it's falling off. D&D are more likely focused on the key characters and the end game vs adding continual richness and texture to characters. I think the same could be said about some others as well, like Jamie.

The one single character that in the series has been tremendously elevated beyond the books is Cersei. D&D seem to love Cersei. It will be very interesting to see if she takes the throne in the books. She might though.

Davos vs Euron isn't a random thouhgt. Davos makes some sense given his background. SEAworth says a lot, lol.

Yes, Dany did say that re Viserys. But, that's not how I took her re not feeling good about her homecoming. And she says she doesn't want to rule over ashes. But, I think Yara and Ellaria getting a beat down will change her thoughts. REcall Mereen. She tried it Tyrion's way then ultimately burned her enemies! Do you recall all those sailors she burned on the ships in the bay? Dany has a history of making ashes. Look at what she did to the dothraki leaders. She burned them alive! I appreciate the consistent writing re her character in this regard. She says she wants one thing but has consistently done something pretty much opposite when it comes to hard things in battle.

Looking back on the scene when Tyrion looked surprised when Dany said she didn't want to rule over ashes, I can see 2 reasons for his look. A) She has a history of making ashes and B)she stole his line.


Mike V. said...

Yeah I think it's safe to say we're going to lose a dragon. They can't make that weapon and have it not work.

Fair point on Jon. Not sure how they could get him to KL. I should correct a statement I made earlier. I don't think they announced plans for the Dothraki Horde yet. The unsullied are going to casterly rock. Not sure where the Dothraki are going. Cersei threatened the southern lords that the Dothraki were coming but Tyrion made a point of conquering king's landing with westerosi armies.

I'd say that could free up the Dothraki to head north with Jon, but I don't think they're equipped to fight in the cold climates. Granted...the cold climates should be heading south too.

I just don't see the Braavos stuff coming into play anymore. I know it's a pet peeve of yours. But they DID fund of the points they made in the show is that they always get their money back. If the crown doesn't pay them back, they will fund the enemies of the crown. Stannis didn't win. So that's the problem with that scenario.

I agree that Jaime has gone against his character reform as well. He did show signs of the new him when talking to Walder Frey at the end of last season. I think we'll see reformed Jaime again before all is said and done. (again...if Tyrion comes face to face with his siblings we'll see where loyalties lie.....I could see a scenario where Cersei is finally going to end Tyrion and Jaime picks his favorite sibling)

I think D&D love Cersei because of Lena Headey's performance as Cersei. In the books she's certifiably insane. I think we're seeing that in the show too...but in a different way. It definitely will be interesting to see if GRRM follows the same route in the book.

nice on SEAworth. lol I just don't see Davos abandoning Jon...but maybe that will be a bargaining chip between Jon and Dany. Maybe we'll even get the other pirate guy that Davos hired a couple times (Salladhor Saan).

Oh I know things will change with Dany...she'll WANT to take KL by force...and with Olenna telling her to be the dragon that enforces that as well. But, I don't know if that will be her end state goal. She wanted to take Meereen by force too but Tyrion suggested a different approach and she listened. So she's getting conflicting advice and she'll probably come out with some kind of compromise. (e.g. maybe she won't burn ALL of king's landing but will strategically target the red keep. lol)

I can't remember Tyrion's specific look to Dany, but I think he would take pride if she used his line. lol

MJ said...

Jeez - you guys have been busy.

Funny with all the info and some having it when convenient for the story. Cause I wondered how Euron knew that Yara and Sand people aligned with Dany ! Typical we see Missendi all nude but not even a glimpse of the 'worm' as you called it. LOL Odd though - feel like that scene should have been 2 seasons ago. Not only is Jon leaving with Bran coming - Arya is coming too !

I find it hard to see how that arrow thing can kill a dragon. Pierce the dragon sure - but kill it ? But yeah - I have always assumed some dragons will die.

Mike V. said...

Oh yeah...I know. Something has to go totally wrong before there is a 3 Stark sibling reunion! lol Of course, they all think they're going there to see Jon. Won't they be thrilled when they find SANSA there? lol I know...petty differences don't matter anymore, but Sansa was quite annoying back in the day! (some argue she still is, but no one can argue that she's been through her share of crap)

Yeah...the Grey Worm/Missendi scene seems a long time coming. But, I guess it took time and motivation for Grey Worm to work up the courage to say something. I think Grey Worm is a character in the books, but I don't recall any huge role for him. The unsullied are just known to be an emotionless force under the command of Dany in the books. Grey Worm, in the show, has been developing emotions since Dany freed him.

I'd question more how many of these spear shooting devices are the making and how easy will it be to hit a moving target? And how quickly can it be reloaded? If they have 100s of them and they're rapid firing at the dragons, then YES maybe they'll get one down. But if they have 1 and it takes 20 seconds or more to load each spear? You better have a dead shot shooter in your army. lol

Mike V. said...

EW Links:

Missendi Interview:

Arya Interview:

Nymeria Sand Interview (IRON FIST Girl):

Hot Pie Interview:

EW Recap:

Mike V. said...

Hot Pie asking Arya that she made pies and she said "just 1 or 2". Totally didn't make the connection that she was referring to the "FREY Pies" :) lol

Also I provided the link last week but here's the Reddit thread discussing this episode. Always love to read the most popular comments and some of the responses to those. People make good and hilarious observations.

These posts are a few stand outs:

- "On this weeks episode of 'The Disgusting Adventures of Samwell Tarly'..."

- "Say what you will about ramsay but he'd be great at getting that Greyscale off"

- Responding to someone who thinks Sam may be the key to winning the war: "Sam graduates from school and counsels Jon, who wins the Iron Throne with Dany. Sam then single-handedly kills Jon, Dany, Cersei, Jamie, the Mountain, and the Hound, shocking everyone. Sam sits on the iron throne.

Flash forward - Sam is now older. We watch from behind as Sam executes every remaining character you even mildly cared about. Sam then turns around. He's wearing a GRRM hat and glasses. Sam is GRRM. He pulls out a quill and an empty book. He thinks for a moment, and on the cover, he first writes "There And Back Again" before crossing it out. Then he writes "A Song of Ice and Fire: a Game of Thrones."

The Game of Thrones theme song plays. The credits roll. GRRM shows up at your house and stabs you in your sleep.

- Read somewhere else(I think in EW comments) "how pissed do you think Varys was when he found out Hot Pie knew Jon Snow was King of the North before him?"

Anonymous said...

Those are good.

From what I've read GRRM really does ID as Sam. Hopefully it won't take Sam as long to write, lol.

BTW, I saw a blurb today about GRRM releasing 2 books next year. That would be great, esp if he beats the show time frame.

I googled it and found that eunochs can still 'arise' to the ocassion, lol. BTW, I agree MJ, the scene between them should have happened at least a season ago if not more. I found it anticlimatic particulary with everything else going on. I mean, she's not going to get pregnant.

I suspect they will have more than one dragon killer machine. But, keep in mind the dragons fly low and slow when they burn things. And the dragon being injured in the arena was a bit foreshadowing perhaps.

Euron knowing about Yara seems pretty straightforward to me. I mean he's the chosen rightful king of the clan she's trying to usurp. So, there' probably many spies in her midst.

Yea, SEAworth "abandoning" Jon was not what I thought. I did consider his reluctance to leave Jon and that may keep him from doing it. That's why I asked it as opposed to saying it's likely. My "?" marks are intentional. It's just that the story needs somebody to defeat Euron and it makes sense that it would be at sea. Yara could be the one to take him down, but after his victory over her so easily won it seems unlikely that she could persuade a waring type people and she has NO ships now. So, trying to figure out who could beat the only person who has won a battle vs Dany troops, Davos is an obvious candidate. But, I am kind of warming to your proposal of Salladhor.

Yea, Bravos only got one line from me since it's likely going the way of Stoneheart, lol.

BTW, I did not recall Arya felt that positively about Jon. Do you think she would prefer Jon over Sansa??? Her abandoning the quest to kill Cersei(atleast momentarily) must have had a powerful motivation.

YOu know, the more I think about the extremely complex interwoven intricacies that GRRM has given us, the more I can see why it takes a while to write and rewrite before finished product!


Mike V. said...

I'll comment more later but check the last recap comments. I posted a link about the 2 books. It's super vague and one of the books is fire and blood (basically the backstory stuff he wrote to fill in the history of westeros to support his writing of a song of ice and fire).

He was very uncertain about 2018 for winds. Basically we need to stop hoping and it'll come out when it does. Lol

Mike V. said...

And touché on complex interwoven plots! I couldn't imagine writing something this in depth.

Mike V. said...

Catching up on everything else you wrote, Richard.

Good point on Dragons flying low and slow when they burn. Yes the injury in the arena is definitely foreshadowing, considering Qyburn referred to it. Lol

Not sure you remember, but Euron’s first command as leader of Pyke was ordering the deaths of Yara and Theon. I can’t recall if that was before or after he realized they fled with the ships.

I didn’t think of Davos abandoning Jon in as so much as maybe Jon offers him up to fight in her war in some kind of exchange. I get you’re just theorizing. I was trying to lend some ideas to the theory. Lol It makes sense….Dany’s water force has been destroyed (as far as I know…not sure if it’s all of it). If Davos is able to recruit Saan again…maybe there is something there.

Agreed on Braavos.

Arya’s closest bond was with Jon. Recall when he had needle made for her? When she found out Jon was at Winterfell she dropped everything to go back. Yes she would prefer Jon over Sansa! But seeing Sansa would be just as powerful at this point.

Anonymous said...

OK, yea I was thinking Jon had needle made and worked with her on archery.

So, Arya won't like Petyr either. She will see a huge difference with Sansa just as Sansa will with Arya.

All will make for some good family squabbles.

So, why didn't he kill Yara if she is supposed to be killed(rhetorical question given D&D has a plan)? As I understand the typical GoT storyline Yara has 2 possibilities which are polar opposites(LOL):
1. She's crucified, burned at the stake or some other wise publically executed as a traitor. Which she is.
2. She beats Euron to a pulp and takes over the Iron Islands,etc.

Any bets on which one will happen or do you have a 3rd?

I'm hoping she's executed. Wouldn't it be absolutely crazy if Theon survives to eventually take over after Yara and Euron are killed,lol.


Mike V. said...

Exactly with Arya and Sansa. They've been through too much not to bond now.

But squabbles will still happen. lol

Not sure why he didn't kill Yara yet. Probably wants to savor in torturing her then killing her time to come up with an escape plan. Or maybe Theon will come out of his reek shell and save her. So yeah...leaning towards option 2. But granted, the Greyjoy storyline is the least popular storyline which is probably why this is playing out now. If any of these people die it wouldn't be a huge loss. (hence the sand snakes being killed off for fan service...and the fact that one of the actresses is now a series regular on Iron Fist and could barely even make this episode work. Apparently, the conflict was initially going to span over a couple episodes)

That would be interesting if Theon gets the salt throne by default. Hence why the writers had him jump ship since we care about him the most. lol (CARE is a strong word)

MJ said...

Bran - who is supposed to send the Raven ? He doesn't have one. Only Meera and they dead uncle know he is alive at this time

Hmm - I thought a large cross bow was kinda lame.

Yara - was surprised how quickly they were defeated. I mean - she did have Iron born leave with her and they are experienced sea farers. And how does an entire flooet of ships sneak up on you any way ? And she should have been the ruler. Succession normally goes to the son - not the brother. But because they are afraid of being led by a woman they broke tradition and chose the man who killed their leader. Her people betrayed her - as did Euron who killed her father and stole her birthright. that is why she is sympathetic.

Anonymous said...

Bran arrived at the wall, castle black. They have ravens there and him being alive is huge news.

Yea, some sort of canon with new Qyborn technology would have been better.

She had a much smaller number of iron born go with her than stayed and backed Euron.

LOL, yea how does Euron do all of that sneaking. LIke with Jaime not knowing a 1000 ships were in his bay and him being the head of the army. Well, tradition doesn't include passing down to daughters and when Theon refused that opened up for them to vote on who they wanted. Think about the Baratheons, brother fighting brother for the right to rule--it's been done several times. Even though tradition goes to the eldest brother. LOL, tradition seems to be flexible when it comes to might making right. IE, just look at Dany, she killed her brother.


Anonymous said...

BTW, one key element with Euron beating Yara--I think he took the Dornish soldiers down since I think they were on the ships. It has to be big enough of a blow to Dany to get her to change her plans anyway.


Mike V. said...

Euron/Dany – I thought that’s why we were talking about the Davos theory. She’s lost her naval army. So there may be alternate planning to be made. Maybe Saan gets involved through Davos. We’ll see. But yeah could change plans in Jon’s favor too.

Bran – I read theories that maybe Sansa will send Brienne/Pod to go escort Bran and Meera down…which also eliminates some of her protection from Littlefinger.
Will write more later.

Mike V. said...

Euron and the sneaking – he has a ship called the “SILENCE” for a reason. He’s stealthy, boasts about his ability to command the seas since his exile. This scene was supposed to back up his words. The silence thing is multi-purposed…apparently in the book he cut the tongues off of everyone he captured and recruited them to his armada. The tongues keep them silent to prevent any mutiny rallies. (sidenote: in show we see them cutting out the tongues of Yara’s crew that they captured. We also saw them only shaking their heads at Ellaria when she demanded to be killed.) The fact that none of Euron’s fleet can talk may have attributed to their stealthy arrival.

I can’t speak for the other lack of knowledge across the realm except – BECAUSE TV CONVENIENCE! lol

Anonymous said...

I think she's lost BOTH her Yara navy and her Dornish land forces. Which would be a big narrowing of the combatants.

Very interesting theory about Sansa sending Brienne/Pod to get Bran.

Great point on cutting out the tongues, I was wondering about that!

BTW, I cheated and read the title for the next ep as well as EP 4.


Anonymous said...

I just remembered that Ellaria killed Doran to get the throne. Tyene was in on it too. He was a decent ruler and so her/Tyene and the Dornish being wiped out doesn't bother me.


Mike V. said...

Here's a question - why would Ellaria sail her Dornish forces across the narrow sea all the way to Slaver's Bay just to bring them back to Westeros? I assume Varys only brought back Ellaria and the Sand Snakes and maybe a skeleton crew to Meereen to forge an alliance with Dany. I think the Dornish forces are probably still there. They needed the ships to bring the Dothraki and Unsullied to Meereen.

I'll try to stay away from the episode titles, but I never succeed. lol I think I knew about Battle of the Bastards early in the season last year. :)

Anonymous said...

The more I think about it, Dany has only the Tyrell's left as a Westerosi ally. That makes Jamie's discussion with Tully even more important. I think the Tully's and Tyrell's are allies so that could get complicated. I just can't see Jon sending his troops from the North to help her take KL. With the unsullied headed to Casterly Rock that means she only has the Dothraki and Tyrell's left for KL.

And of course her dragons.

Looks like the forecast is for fire and ashes.

It will be interesting to see if Jamie goes to Casterley Rock to fight the unsullied or who it might be. The unsullied just may roll over Casterly Rock but since there's no gold, what significance is it really. Doesn't Tyrion know there is no more gold?


Anonymous said...

I think Euron caught them heading towards KL, after the Dornish army pick up. I think that's part of the point where the sand snakes were talking about all the people they were getting ready to kill. I could be wrong but have read a few others who have said the same thing. Plus it kind of makes sense as the story is narrowing. I mean, with Ellaria dead who is going to be newly introduced at this point as a Dornish leader to bring an entire army to KL. It was Ellaria killing Doran and usurped control that was causing them to fight for Dany. And in reality it was not so much for Dany as it was against Cersei for revenge. The Dornish were traditionally allies aligned with the Tully's and Lanisters.

The only Westerosi allies Dany has are those who want revenge on Cersei. And while Cersei is horrible the thought of foreign invaders taking over your homeland is worse because you know another King from your own will eventually rise.

When the Dothraki and unsullied are seen laying waste it is possible Cersei could have more allies. BUT, I didn't write the story, lol.

Jon would certainly like to take down Cersei but he knows about the bigger threat in the North.


Mike V. said...

I think you mean TARLY not Tully. That’s Sam’s dad he was talking to and Jaime was telling him to break his oath with Lady Olenna and he would be rewarded with being warden of the South. I don’t think they were hinting that the Tyrells would switch sides to support the Lannisters. Don’t think that’s going to happen. Looking at your next post. I’m pretty sure they were heading south TO Dorne. I get with all the passage of time that maybe we could assume they skipped the dorne pickup…..but I don’t think so. Maybe??? That’s a good question actually. Will probably be cleared up next week.

The Jaime to Casterly Rock was a prediction of another “after show” I listened to. Basically the Unsuillied will usurp Casterly Rock and Jaime will bring forces there to take it back. I don’t know if Tyrion knows there’s no more gold. I forget who Tywin had that conversation with.

I think the whole Westerosi allies thing is where Dany’s alliance with the North will become important too. But, again, I just don’t see how they can help with the King’s Landing invasion. I also still don’t think we’ve lost the entire Martell Army. I think they lost the ships. I think this was all about Euron bringing Cersei a prize and that prize is the people that conspired to and killed Myrcella.
See I always thought that when the threat came from the North it wouldn’t really matter who sat on the Iron Throne. If Dany helped Jon defeat the White Walkers she would be loved by the people (as long as they actually witnessed the threat and knew it was real). But of course, if Jon was revealed as the rightful heir to the throne…who knows what would happen? Clearly, he doesn’t want to rule anyway. Of course, a Dany/Jon marriage might be the perfect solution outside the fact that they are related. But there is precedent in the story for that.

Something tells me this story is going to take a few more twists and turns before it’s over.

Anonymous said...

LOL, Yes Tarly and that's the deal I was referring to. Jaime wanting him to break with the Tyrells.

But, even if there are some Dornish/martells around, who's going to lead them? Do you really think they will introduce a new Martell at this point? Doran was admired by his people and I always found it a bit wierd that they just accepted Ellaria.

Agree, should be cleared up next week when Elaria and Tyene are executed. It's strange, I'm actually rooting for Cersei here to make it slightly cruel after what Elaria did. The guy was in a wheelchair and they ganged up on him, it was awful.

Yea, I don't think Dany is going for love, LOL.

The forecast is for "fire and ashes", lol. Lots of it.


Mike V. said...

The Dornish/Martells are aligned with the Tyrells, Dothraki and Unsullied and of course the mother of Dragons. If they want revenge for the abduction of their leaders (which...I you said they did kill Doran) they may still follow Dany into battle. Let's not forget they still have to have a story arc for Theon. I don't think he's story ends with him being a coward and just waiting for Gendry to pick him up at sea to row into obscurity! lol

I wouldn't say right off the bat that Ellaria and Tyene will be executed.

As for Dany and love. Dany is a mixed bag at this point. She has Tyrion to balance her potential crazy. She makes comments about not wanting to be queen of the ashes, but she has a temper like her father and they're making many allusions to the Mad King. But, she's also shown love and sympathy throughout her story. Breaker of chains, stopper of rape. She's a queen for the people. If anyone is closer to being a Mad Queen at this point it's Cersei. She's done things that Aerys never got a chance to do (i.e. blew up the Sept with Wildfire).

Which brings us to Jaime...I think there's only so long that he's going to be blinded by his love for Cersei before he does something about it. there's no way they're going to throw away all of that character development for him to be a pawn in Cersei's game. She is doing some mirror image stuff of a previous monarch he stood beside. And what did he do to that one? Stabbed him in the back to save the city. He also had that conversation with Brienne last season to show his humanity is still there. But he also had the conversation with Edmure that he would do anything to be with Cersei. Something will have to happen to crack through that she's a monster, and he's going to turn.

As for Fire and Ashes...yeah...there's no doubt Dany will use her dragons, but if Tyrion has any say in it there will be a strategy around it and not just a "let's light the city on fire and rule what's left!"

Anonymous said...

You're saying Theon could lead the Dornish? I agree he has a future, probably a longer term future than Euron. But, that seems a stretch. I also see the storyline continuing to concentrate. I'm at a pretty high % that Ellaria will be executed in the next ep given its' title.

We'll know for sure about the Dornish, probably next Sunday night. The Dornish are aligned with those you mentioned since Ellaria wanted revenge on Cersei. Traditionally they were with the Lannisters. REcall Myrecella was sent to their great allies for safety,etc. Again, Ellaria had to kill Doran since he was a strong Lannister ally. I've never liked that whole Dornish storyline. I mean it made zero since that Ellaria could just take over the entire country by assassinating their monarch. She had no claim to the throne. She wasn't a wife to Oberyn. It's really quite ludicrous when you think about it. I don't recall her killing Doran in the books btw.


Mike V. said...

I wasn't suggesting Theon can lead the Dornish (maybe it was implied by what I said), but there's still a redemption story to happen there. Surely, he'll want to save his sister?

Well Tyrion was TRYING to forge an alliance between the Martells and Lannisters, but there was too much history there for it to stick. Maybe Doran would've tried to continue that but Ellaria took over and was out for revenge. No one liked the Dorne storyline. Frankly, we're probably talking too much about it! lol It was a rushed story when they brought it on and no one accepted it. Obviously, Oberyn Martell was handeled awesomely and Ellaria was great in season 4. But then they just became caricatures in season 5 and beyond, obsessed with revenge.

The whole reason Ellaria killed Doran was BECAUSE the story didn't work on the show. No, it definitely didn't happen in the books. People enjoyed the Dorne story more in the books. (I, honestly, had a hard time getting accustomed to the new characters. I liked Arianna Martell, but they didn't even introduce her in the show) Yes, I don't think anyone has thought it was plausible that Ellaria could just usurp the kingdom and have everyone follow her, but we just had to go with it because the storyline was a huge fail. And they only reason they kept the story in play was for an alliance with Dany. And, if you just drop characters out of the show without explaining....the story doesn't quite make sense. (ahem...GENDRY! I'm still holding out hope lol)

It's pretty obvious why the Dornish are the first to be taken off the map. It's fan service to the Thrones watchers. It's like LOST killing off Nikki and Paolo in epic fashion (though, they always say they knew it wasn't working before it even aired). So you're probably right, Cersei will execute Ellaria and Tyene...or she'll torture them to the point that they wished they were dead. (see: REEK)

Anonymous said...

Yea, I could see some torture for Ellaria similar to the shame lady by Cersei.

I AGREE, what's up with Gendry?!

Honestly, as I said earlier, what GRRM has done is fantastic. He avoided these awful storylines that D&D got themselves into, like how they handled the Dornish. I think he was able to avoid them since he kept thinking and rethinking them through. It really is amazing work he has done. It bothers me that we are moving further and further away from the books. It makes me wonder why Stoneheart was dropped for example.

I really want to see Yara taken off the map as you say. And of course Euron and Cersei. In many ways she's a sympathetic character and helped her brother but so are many other characters and she decided to fight her own people. Greyjoy vs Greyjoy doesn't make a lot of sense for someone who says they love their people. Again, GRRM would have probably handled it differently.

I can't see the show without Euron and/or Cersei in S8--somebody needs to be an antagonist other than the Night King for several more eps. But, I can easily see the show without Yara and we're in a condensing mode. I suspect Euron or Cersei will be done for later this season and it will most likely be Euron since D&D like Lena Headey. Theon for whatever reason seems to be another character they like. So, with Euron and Yara gone, that's why I proposed Theon as the reluctant Greyjoy monarch.

In thinking about it last night, there really aren't any characters I really like that much any more. I loved Ned and Catelyn. I liked Tyrion pre Dany and Jaime for a couple of seasons(not so much now). And Tywin had a great actor. But,as the characters are being portrayed now, I don't have one that I'm really that interested in.


Mike V. said...

Yes I had Septa Onella in mind too (Shame Lady). If she had that done to a woman that enjoyed messing with Cersei imagine what Cersei wants to do to Ellaria. It wouldn't surprise me if she burned them using Wildfire (similar to what Aerys used to do) fact, this would be a trigger for Jaime to take action.

I think some would disagree with you on how GRRM handled expanding his world. When reading the books, people really loved reading the POV chapters of people they've been following since the beginning. Even when we got in Jaime's mind 3 books in it was nice. But then, he started expanding more and more. And we started reading about Dorne and Pyke and it was booooooooring. lol But, it made sense to expand his world. But everyone was just ready to CONTRACT already! Which is why the show shrunk books 4 and 5 into basically 1 season and then misc. stories in seasons 4 and 6. If GRRM got his way, this should would've lasted 20 seasons. He kept writing in his blog about how the show could keep going while he had time to finish book 6 and 7. He saw like 5 seasons worth of material from books 4 and 5. Things don't translate well to TV and you have to give D&D credit for covering what they were able to cover. Afterall when GRRM set out to make A Song of Ice and Fire he was a TV show writer. And he set out to write an epic tale that would be unadaptable for films and television. lol

I can totally see Euron/Cersei not making it out of this season. Cersei is killed, the wall comes down and the living band together to unite against the incoming threat. All these petty squabbles don't matter anymore. I'm sure it won't play out exactly like that, but I wouldn't rule it out. Just reread the rest of what you wrote. You're willing to sacrifice one of them in season 7. lol I could see both of them going, but yeah if one has to stay it's probably Cersei. But, I think her story has pretty much run its course. I can definitely see Yara not making it (unless Theon stages a coup to save her. Then having her killed kinda defeats the purpose).

There's still characters I like...and I think Jaime's redemption arc is just taking a small detour. He'll be back. I've always been Team Jon Snow...and his acting has improved through the story. Always loved Arya...while I don't agree with her methods, the actress is great and always loved her story. I'm a Stark Boy so I'll follow them to the end! And I still like Tyrion even though he's been marginalized a bit. I think he'll have a part to play.

Anonymous said...

Yea, I'm still thinking Jaime will kill Cersei. He's a younger brother. That will make it interesting and it seems like it will be something around her being mad.

I just think D&D will want Lena in the final season, but that's really a guess. And it will be related to how long KL will be under her control. I could see a big culminating battle over KL as a finale this season and Cersei biting the dust then or first part of next season. LOL, this thought just occured to me, what if they cut this season part way through that battle? I'm not sure how I'd feel about it, but it would certainly create a lot of speculation discussion,etc.

BTW, I have been finding it a weak storyline that Jaime is still in love with her when she doesn't have anything intimate to do with him. Maybe he's becoming more distant and we just haven't seen it yet?


Anonymous said...

Where is MJ, I miss her observations and perspectives!


Mike V. said...

I think MJ only comments the first couple days after an episode, then she just tells us we're crazy for discussing/debating the show so much. lol I obsess over this show/books. It's the closest thing I've been obsessed about since LOST.

Yeah it wouldn't surprise me if Lena is in the final season and for the reasons you stated. It just seems like her war should end this season. Interesting idea with having the battle be a cliffhanger into next season.

I think Jaime is having an internal struggle right now. It's tough to show that on screen. But in episode 1 he was really questioning Cersei's actions. She asked if he fears her. And he said, "Should I?" Even made that comment that she's the queen of "3 kingdoms" at best. I think he sees the writing on the wall, but he's still going through the motions due to his love for Cersei. But, that may fade if she keeps going down the crazy path. lol

MJ said...

LOL - I try to keep up but yeah - you guys have way too many comments some days. Crazy times at work too.

Bran - I had forgotten that Bran finally arrived at the castle after the should-be-dead uncle left him under the tree. That little scene where the guy (know not Eddard but something close) says to prove he is a Stark and Bran and Meera say a bunch of stuff that proves nothing. LOL

Very true about bother fighting brother for the throne and it going to men. The North seems more advanced then that though - but we shall see when Bran if he ever shows up at Winterfel. Because technically he is the rightful heir to the house Stark if you go by their laws.

Euron and 'the silence' - if they haven't stated it in the show it doesn't exist in my opinion.

Mike V. said...

Never too many comments! :) But I understand busy times at work. I'll see comments come in on my email and I have to fight the urge to respond while I'm paying attention in a meeting!

Bran - There was a funny comment on Reddit last week (I think I pasted it in the comments) that when Bran starts talking all philosophical about the long night....EDD just says, "'re a stark alright" lol but there was some nice use of profanity in the quote. Yeah what he said really proves nothing except that he knows a lot of stuff and how does he know it? (making him somewhat important)

Richard has been saying the same thing about makes sense. If people find out he's alive and find out Jon's a Targaryan (but also a Stark) there could be some trouble in the north.

Euron/Silence - They showed Euron's men cutting out tongues of their captives. It was a direct reference from the books. And none of the men made any noise except Euron (screaming when he came onto the ship) They shook their heads when Ellaria demanded to be killed.

Speaking of - was just listening to the latest episode of BINGE MODE (podcast. finally listened to all 60 and they've kept going in season 7) and they reminded us that Tyene is Ellaria's ACTUAL that makes her valuable to Cersei. I can see Cersei killing Tyene and keeping Ellaria alive for torture. (You know since she had Myrcella killed)

Also....Arya and Nymeria's moment...Arya acknowledged that Nymeria is a loner (albeit with her pack of wolves) like Arya....and it's not her to join Arya and go back home to Winterfell. It reflects back to season 1 when Arya said "that's not me to Ned" about getting domesticated, getting married and having children...normal life and all. I mentioned this in recap....the reason I bring it up again...what if this chance meeting with Nymeria inspires Arya to continue her quest and NOT go home? Didn't really think about it that way, but I guess it's possible. I do think she'll head back though. But it would be SOOOOOO game of thrones like for that reunion not to happen. lol

Mike V. said...

Euron - oh right and his ship's name is "THE SILENCE". He told Cersei and Jaime that in the throne room.

MJ said...

Yeah - I read that about her comment to the dire wolf.

**** spoiler for next ep **** Sorta. It was easily guessed at the pace they were going.

I saw headline that had pics of Jon and Dany meeting next ep. So they def are not wasting time with traveling

Mike V. said...

The Direwolf comment - Yeah I was just wondering if that was an indication that Arya may change her mind about going to winterfell, since she's basically abandoning her mission, her personal oath to finish her kill list. I hadn't originally considered it from that perspective.

I saw the pics as well, and it was also teased in the previews for next week. I don't really consider that stuff spoilery, but I guess some people might. Definitely not wasting any time! And that's fine. I had heard this season will be faster paced and that makes sense.

MJ said...

Ah ! I don't watch the previews ! LOL

This is interesting maybe. Possible spoiler on how the Night King and Wights get over the wall - so don't look if you don't want to possibly be spoiled

Mike V. said...

I saw the opening credits thing screenshot too. Was gonna share, but then a lot of podcasts I listen to dismissed it. The Wall is definitely different than the previous opening credits. But, I think they're trying to show that winter weather is coming down further and not a frozen river. lol

I think at this point it's a foregone conclusion that the wall is coming down. Too much foreshadowing in statements made last season and this season for it not to happen!

I know you don't watch previews. :) I've gotten in the habit of skipping them for most shows now, but for Thrones I can't resist! lol

MJ said...

Yeah - I wondered at the validity of the supposition that the water is frozen. LOL

Anonymous said...

I think the WW are going through Eastwatch. And there may be enough of them to attack Eastwatch and Castle Black. I would think Castle Black will fall at some point to show just how bad things are, etc.

I agree Mike, this show has me into it like LOST did.


Mike V. said...

Yeah they're definitely going to try through Eastwatch. People were theorizing though that if they could freeze the sea(as they thought was hinted by the opening credits) they could walk around the wall by the Eastwatch castle. While an interesting theory, it kind of defeats the purpose of the wall coming down. lol Or the wall being there in the first place!